Where does Guitar Tone Come From?

[cuttime]

I'm not a guitarist, but I'm fully aware of snake oil in music technology. This is probably going to tweak some noses out there:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... sic-myths/

[bayswater]

I'm suitably outraged.

But really, I think there really is a lot of snobbery with guitars, amps, tone, and instrument making.

[wylie1]

In the end having a good speaker in your cabinet is the key

[HCMarkus]

New strings, good pickups, too.

Although I didn't listen to the examples, I'm not too excited about the styrofoam speaker box... not very stack worthy! And I'd have to shell out for custom-made cases for ALL these devices except the car, for which a nice cover would probably suffice.

[Michael Canavan]

I wish this stuff wasn't so click bait-y. He in the article goes after body tone, and cabinet tone, but completely ignores pickup type, speaker type etc.

The real answer is yes, IMO wood type isn't that important, but only within types of wood, i.e. a Tesco guitar with a semi hollow balsa wood body is going to sound VASTLY different than a Gibson Les Paul. The difference between a Les Paul and another hardwood guitar with humbuckers is going to be far less obvious. IMO the difference is and always has been the resonance of the wood or material, it directly affects sustain. Pick up type is another drastic difference in tone. I went with a single Les Paul with humbuckers for decades, and chose two other guitars with drastically different body types and pickups. A cut out Gretsch with their take on humbuckers and a single coil Telecaster. These things matter.

I feel like every article like this is just intellectually giving us the middle finger, there's so much left out of the discussion intentionally just to make the writer seem brilliant. I totally get trashing on the people who make weird claims about 1950's Les Pauls or some other hyperbolic nonsense, but I get the impression this article is more geared towards plebs who think that Hendrix was born with awesome tone.

[HCMarkus]

there's so much left out of the discussion intentionally just to make the writer seem brilliant.

Yeah, Scientific American. I thought there were going to be some graphs and measurements, comparing impulse responses, etc. Pretty weak.

Especially if you listen on a laptop or a phone.

[James Steele]

I wish this stuff wasn't so click bait-y. He in the article goes after body tone, and cabinet tone, but completely ignores pickup type, speaker type etc.

There's a lot that goes into it and a lot of theories and it can get very contentious. I've seen some YouTube videos suggesting that the effect of "tone wood" at least on solid body guitars is grossly exaggerated, assuming that the wood is of similar density. And perhaps as you suggest, subtleties may be lost with humbucking pickups as opposed to single coil.

One school of thought which makes a good deal of sense is that the speaker selection (if using a traditional amplifier) can make the largest difference... more so than other factors.

I am a believer in wood density and mass making a difference. For example, about 20 years ago I bought a brand new Les Paul Standard at a local guitar store (which has since gone out of business, sadly). I went into the store looking for a new Gold Top, but alas, they had none. I decided to check out others and the store may have had about 10 or so Standards in stock. One at a time I lifted each Les Paul from the holder and checked it out. When I got to mine... (the ebony finish with creme pickguard, creme bezels, gold knobs a la early Jeff Beck)... it nearly dropped to the floor as I was not ready for how much heavier it was than the others. We've probably all seen the pictures of guys who've torn apart their Les Pauls after breaking the neck or whatever and you can see that they've taken a hole saw to the body and chambered it to reduce the weight. I'm certain this wasn't done to mine. It is HEAVY! I used to hand it to people who wanted to see it at gigs for my cover band years ago and they were shocked! However, I'm convinced that the density and mass of the body gave it a "tighter" more focused sound... a little brighter even.

Years later, I was blessed to have the former CEO of Dean Guitars give me an AMAZING deal on any Dean I wanted including a personalized build from their USA custom shop! So when I spec'd out my Dean V, one of the first things I requested that the body was a full 1/4" thicker than their production guitars. (I wanted 1/2" thicker, but there was concern it wouldn't fit into the case.). This was influenced by that Les Paul I owned. The idea was that a V starts out with less wood right off the bat... so making it thicker than usual would give it more mass. It was also for this reason that I went with a top-mounted Floyd Rose instead of a recessed installation-- again to preserve as much wood as possible and have more mass than a standard V.

I'm very happy with the result. I was very fortunate. I actually spec'd out every detail of the guitar. Dean essentially built it for me based on my specs and a Photoshop mockup of a result that I had spent weeks of trial and error arriving at. (I'm now going to have to dig out a photo).

• 1/4" thicker than usual Mahogany body
• Spalted maple top
• Straight Six head stock (as opposed to V shaped)
• Spalted maple veneer on head stock with "JSV" (for James Steele V)
• Trans Red finish with black binding on body and headstock
• Custom designed pick guard from black/red/black laminate
• Black hardware including top-mounted Original Floyd Rose with D-Tuna
• 24 fret neck with compound 12"-16" radius
• Stainless steel jumbo frets
• MOP fret markers using design from Dean's "Deceiver" model
• Custom Dean DMT red/black zebra "Time Capsule" pickups
• Two volume controls (bridge/neck) with no tone. Toggle switch between volume knobs. Push/Pull pot on rear (neck) control switching both pickups to single coils.
• "Hidden" wiring
• Kill switch button positioned on front (on the pick guard)
• Custom "Rush-inspired" serial number


I can't resist some photos now since this really is my pride and joy, and like I said, but for an AMAZING deal, I'd NEVER have had the opportunity to have a guitar of this quality built to my own specifications.

First... here is a side-by-side. My Photoshop mockup (left) which was done before the finished guitar (right) was even begun:

sidebyside.jpg (686.04 KiB) Viewed 5811 times

Here's a pic of the control cavity with special "hidden" wiring:

wiring.jpg (160.45 KiB) Viewed 5811 times

When I saw the build sheet I realized that my serial number was only 32 off from a tribute to one of my favorite bands ever. I asked if I might have a special serial number and they were able to accommodate me! Hat tip to the priests of the Temple of Syrinx!

serialnumber.jpg (191.85 KiB) Viewed 5811 times

Lastly, one of the folks in the Custom Shop sent the pic of the finished guitar to Floyd Rose company and they featured it on their official Instagram. I think it still has the most "likes" of any guitar they have posted:

floydroseofficial.jpg (132.48 KiB) Viewed 5811 times

[stubbsonic]

I came on here to say pretty much what was stated above-- about speakers, pickups, and the affect of woods on sustain. Hear hear.

Another thing about materials choice is just geometry stability over time-- e.g., how well the wood ages and does or doesn't warp, shrink, etc. over time. For an electric body, pretty much a non issue. For necks, pretty much everything.

[Michael Canavan]

Yep anyone who thinks wood density doesn't have an effect needs to play a Les Paul Custom then a Tesco or Silvertone with balsa wood bodies.

Nice looking Guitar Steve, I'm not a super V guy, but that red V I would play for sure.

[HCMarkus]

I spec'd out my Dean V

That's a beaut, James!

[cuttime]

Thanks for the enlightening input! Yes, I think SciAm has sort of fallen from grace in the last few years. And, I think there has to be a lot more to the story. For instance, a pickup mounted to the wood would have to have a sympathetic vibration from the resonances in the wood that would affect the tone, no? The same for the mounted strings?

[stubbsonic]

For instance, a pickup mounted to the wood would have to have a sympathetic vibration from the resonances in the wood that would affect the tone, no? The same for the mounted strings?

I think the main point is that the wood type's impact on the tone itself is negligible. That was the upshot of all those tests.

And what we are tempted to think of as resonance (which I suppose it is, technically) is really more just the kinetic energy of the vibrating strings being transferred off the strings through the bridge/nut and into the wood. The amount of the vibrational energy in the neck & body that makes its way to the pickups is probably not very noticeable. The vibration of the strings is much more significant than whatever vibration might make its way to the pickup itself. However, all this does affect how quickly the notes decay.

A hollow body guitar is obviously a different kettle of fish.

[James Steele]

Nice looking Guitar Steve, I'm not a super V guy, but that red V I would play for sure.

Who’s Steve?

[James Steele]

I think the main point is that the wood type's impact on the tone itself is negligible. That was the upshot of all those tests.

And what we are tempted to think of as resonance (which I suppose it is, technically) is really more just the kinetic energy of the vibrating strings being transferred off the strings through the bridge/nut and into the wood. The amount of the vibrational energy in the neck & body that makes its way to the pickups is probably not very noticeable. The vibration of the strings is much more significant than whatever vibration might make its way to the pickup itself. However, all this does affect how quickly the notes decay.

A hollow body guitar is obviously a different kettle of fish.

I think sometimes the differences are only noticeable by the person playing the guitar as there are certain qualities like responsiveness that aren’t apparent if you’re a person in the room merely listening.

[stubbsonic]

I think sometimes the differences are only noticeable by the person playing the guitar as there are certain qualities like responsiveness that aren’t apparent if you’re a person in the room merely listening.

That's an interesting point. Are you including the feeling of the wood of the guitar's body vibrating against the guitar player's body? awkwardly-writhing-emoji