How "Off Pitch" Is "Off Pitch"?

[Siryne]

MIDI Life Crisis/Shooshie: I laughed my ass off-Thanks

Phil O: Thanks for asking. We are doing a re-sing of the session and if that does not do it, I have another singer on deck.
Thanks
Peace!

[richard]

A 440 isn't necessarily standard... especially outside of the US.

I wasn't aware of it being a standard, what are the standards

While I believe more piano tuners work with A440 than any other pitch reference, European tuning is often sharp compared to A440 (like around A444 or even higher).

B# and C are the same pitch.... and while you might not play them equal-tempered in say an orchestral environment, if B# is the third in a G# major triad and if you compare it to a C being the third in an Ab major chord, they just might be the same pitch.

well that makes sense, but in theory they're not the same note, how sharp does sharp have to be to be considered a sharp?, if you play a chromatic slide how many notes are you playing?

Actually theoretically, in equal tempered tuning they are the same pitch, it's just that they are "spelled" differently. A chromatic scale has 12 pitches. I don't know what you mean by chromatic slide though.

The different spellings for the same note exist to help with spelling chords and scale notes. Professional musicians and singers can adjust away from equal temperment because it sounds better depending on the situation. An equal tempered M3 sounds sharp because the lower note's overtones will include a pitch very close to a M3, but slightly lower. When you play an equal tempered M3 the overtones will clash a bit and you'll hear some pitch 'beating'. If you lower the pitch of the 3rd slightly it will start to sound more in tune. (hope I'm making sense... sorry if I'm not)

50 cents is a quarter tone.

well I'll trust your knowledge but is it a perfect 1/4 tone? is there such a thing?

Since quarter tones are just labels we created, if a note matches our definition of a quarter tone (50 cents), then I'd say it's a perfect quarter tone.

pitchy music can be pleasing

I agree. But it can also become painful if too pitchy.

overtones on a note are not perfect but they add to the beauty of an orchestra or choir.

For me, of all the pitch issues and questions and definitions (well, except for the discussion about boob jobs), the closest thing to real perfection are the overtones. The overtone series comes from nature, equal tempered tuning does not.

[bongo_x]

I think most women can spot a boob job, even your "high class" ones.
And maybe most singers can spot most of your best autotune jobs.

And maybe someone who doesn't play the violin will mistake VSL for the real thing but someone who plays the violin will think the VSL violin sounds like a synth patch more than a violin.

What's that saying? "You can fool some of the people..."

I would say you're wrong (except for the violin, I wouldn't know about that). there is a certain number of those people who feel like they need to spot those things for some reason and they are the most vocal. insecurity? they're like psychics making predictions, no one really follows up on most of them, but if they get one right every once in a while...we all know a woman who is constantly trying to point out boob jobs, but most other women are just thinking "nice boobs".

almost all major label releases these days have some (or a lot) of vocal tuning, they don't all sound obvious. when it's done right you just think "well they're good, they didn't need it". well, maybe they are good, and they could do it, but why make them sing it over and over when they already sang it great and I can just tweak it a little?

what's the difference between comping and tuning? I always say if you're multi-tracking, you're already "cheating". I like to tell people that we're making a movie, not filming a play. I don't care if chow yun fat can really out-gun 30 other guys in a restaurant.

I love the fact that fact that I can sit around on a sunday afternoon in my pajamas and exchange wisdom with such fine people. life is good and this is a great board.

MLC; your boob-size-to-pitch ratio hypothesis is fascinating. I must do more research in this area. unfortunately I mostly work with ugly rock guys.
note to self; re-think career.

bb

[richard]

Sooo... let me see if I got this right. Women who sound out of tune can sound more like Suzannah McCorckle if they get a boob job?
A stick, a stone, it's the end of the road, it's the weight of your boobs, it's the size of your load...
Are we getting close now?

Shooshie

It is a little known fact that women with naturally big boobs sing flat, those with naturally small boobs sing sharp (one of natures little practical jokes) and women with boob jobs... well, who cares how the hell they sing, they usually get the job anyway!
My theory is: big boobs pull on the vocal chords, stretching them; small boobs give the chords room to breath; and as far as boob jobs, ... well men are shallow.

Wow, this is great.

Actually MIDI Life Crisis, you're experiencing an aural illusion. If you think women with large breasts are singing flat, it's usually due to the doppler effect kicking in when you move your head up and down from looking at her breasts, then snapping back to her face to not get caught, then looking down, etc.

I was told that women with large breast are incapable of doing any wrong.

And you say men are shallow....

[HCMarkus]

This is a great thread. lol repeatedly. Thanks!

[Siryne]

Thanks so much for all the replys to this thread. I have learned a great deal and laughed a bit too. Thanks so much!
Peace!