MOTUnation.com

mikehalloran wrote: ↑Tue Jan 09, 2024 1:21 pm Long talk with MOTU Support on another issue and brought this one up. Verified that I have the current MOTU driver and that it is loading properly. My Mac sees the MTP AV but the driver does not. He said that there can be some driver loading issues but that it appears not to be the problem with my setup.

Since my unit is long past support, there was nothing more he could do but assured me that, if I bought a current unit and it didn't appear, I could schedule another call and MOTU can try some of those tricks as necessary.

Yeah when I contacted tech support about the MTP/AV they told me it wasn't supported on the latest OS with the latest drivers. Then I found a workaround using the driver right before the latest for the XT, but that stopped working completely in Sonoma.

I've a line on a used micro lite which is more than I really need — letting the owner know that $40 shipping is a deal killer. We'll see.

In the mean time, since Sonoma drivers are not on the MOTU site, I'll keep my MTP AV around to see if, when/if they are released, this comes back to like.

mikehalloran wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 4:31 pm In the mean time, since Sonoma drivers are not on the MOTU site, I'll keep my MTP AV around to see if, when/if they are released, this comes back to like.

They have confirmed Sonoma support for all of their current MIDI interfaces, When you go to download the MtP/AV driver, the latest they recommend is from 2017. https://motu.com/en-us/download/product ... tails=true

They are not developing drivers for the MTP/AV, This is the email response I got from them years ago:

I will be forwarding your feedback along to our development team for further review. Please note that the MIDI Timepiece is not officially supported on M1 devices; the driver from 2017 for this product is the latest driver officially tested with/for this device. We cannot guarantee success using the MTP AV on M1 systems.

So IMO that pretty much says it all, they aren't developing drivers anymore for deprecated products as old as the MTP/AV, I recall other reports coming out that they had no plans to, and considering they haven't since 2016, I would say that's confirmed.

There was a workaround using the latest drivers for the XT series, but that seems broken now too.

I wonder what this means for my Mixer 7s?

James Steele wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 7:41 pm I wonder what this means for my Mixer 7s?

Had to look that up, so those are MIDI controlled Mixers? that's pretty cool actually, Is it using CC 7 to control volume on various channels? looks like that's what it does. These seem like they may predate DAWs?

Yeah. It was a bad joke about trying to keep old MOTU gear running. Looks like it’s time to accept that the MTP/AV had a good run, but it’s time is coming to an end… at least on modern Macs.

I got a reply from Matt on my ticket with MOTU regarding my Mac with Sonoma not seeing the Fastlane. Basically he told me to fully uninstall the driver, then reinstall. I guess he missed the part I included in my original text where I mentioned I was returning that Mac and going back to using my 15" Air with Ventura (which I did before I got his reply)! So, I can't test this. I'll (try to!) summarize quickly - he said to trash these files:

/Applications/ClockWorks.app
/Applications/MOTU USB MIDI System Extension.app
/Library/Audio/MIDI Drivers/MOTU USB MIDI Driver.plugin
/Library/Audio/MIDI Drivers/MOTU MIDI Driver.plugin
/Library/LaunchDaemons/com.motu.driver.usbmidi.dextproxy.launchd.plist
/Library/Application Support/MOTU/MIDI (folder)
/Library/Extensions/MOTU\ MIDI\ Driver.kext

"Note: There may be some items that are not on your machine listed above. That's ok, just ignore it if you don't see one, and move on."

Then check Activity Monitor to make sure no MOTU process is happening, and if so, kill it. Clear trash, restart, and reinstall the MIDI driver.

Brand new MB Air with Sonoma 14.2.1 - installed MOTU MIDI driver Dext 91217 and working with MTP AV. Only installed first driver set of the two offered. Caught the extension warning, but also has an 'Open on Login' warning that requires response to allow in the background. MIDI device and patch lists are not working properly but quick test and KeyLab plays attached hardware devices on the MTP AV. Connecting through the USB 2.0 port on this device https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0C4LX3KQC

Device and patch list assignments appear to be working now. May be needed a restart?

Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 5:27 pm

mikehalloran wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 4:31 pm In the mean time, since Sonoma drivers are not on the MOTU site, I'll keep my MTP AV around to see if, when/if they are released, this comes back to like.

They have confirmed Sonoma support for all of their current MIDI interfaces, When you go to download the MtP/AV driver, the latest they recommend is from 2017. https://motu.com/en-us/download/product ... tails=true
…
There was a workaround using the latest drivers for the XT series, but that seems broken now too.

That is not the same as publishing Sonoma drivers — which MOTU has not done for reasons I've already posted. Likewise, the MTP AV is listed in the current driver and I had the same conversation earlier this week.

Of course, I'm not expecting the MTP AV to work when the Sonoma drivers are released but we've seen this before. The 8pre required a direct FW connection and would not work through the FW-TB adapter until a later driver release fixed that.

So we'll see.. Since the prospect of getting decent money for a used MTP AV is gone, I've nothing to lose but time.

mikehalloran wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 1:45 pm

Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 5:27 pm

mikehalloran wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 4:31 pm In the mean time, since Sonoma drivers are not on the MOTU site, I'll keep my MTP AV around to see if, when/if they are released, this comes back to like.

They have confirmed Sonoma support for all of their current MIDI interfaces, When you go to download the MtP/AV driver, the latest they recommend is from 2017. https://motu.com/en-us/download/product ... tails=true
…
There was a workaround using the latest drivers for the XT series, but that seems broken now too.

That is not the same as publishing Sonoma drivers — which MOTU has not done for reasons I've already posted. Likewise, the MTP AV is listed in the current driver and I had the same conversation earlier this week.

Screenshot 2024-01-12 at 12.53.29 PM.png


Of course, I'm not expecting the MTP AV to work when the Sonoma drivers are released but we've seen this before. The 8pre required a direct FW connection and would not work through the FW-TB adapter until a later driver release fixed that.

So we'll see.. Since the prospect of getting decent money for a used MTP AV is gone, I've nothing to lose but time.

The thing I'm not OK with MOTU about is this sort of confusion, There's not a single reason for disagreement, they confirm that all the latest MIDI hardware they sell works fine with their latest drivers. They also confirm that they're not supporting the MTP/AV on M1, even though they still list it as supported in the latest installers for the XT etc. like you point out here. They haven't updated the installer section on their website for the MTP/AV since 2017, if you go to the Express XT for instance, it's updated in 2022. We all did the workaround of installing the drive for the XT etc, but is was always a workaround, not officially supported, and only standing up because the code still worked without being tested.

I'm not selling mine since it's only good really for Windows, and probably not 11, but I don't have any confidence that they're still developing it. I mean this is company that never seems to officially deprecate anything, Machfive 3 still has a web page on their site, albeit with a warning up top, but still?

As an added data point, my MTP AV is working on my Mac Studio Ultra M1 running OS13 Ventura. It’s plugged into the USB 2.0 port on the back of the Mac Studio.

At some point, I’ll be upgrading to Sonoma, at which point it seems as though I’ll lose function of the MTP AV. I guess it’s given me 25 years or so of service so not a bad deal. Average the cost out over those years and works created through it, and the cost per musical work produced has been pennies!

I have a Yamaha Montage M8x as my master keyboard, so I can just simply use the USB direct MIDI connection to the Mac. I used to hang multiple MIDI keyboards and modules off 2 networked MTP AVs but those days are over!


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The MTP AV USB with the 2.0.1 firmware and the 1.34 USB Controller chip works over Ventura—many of us have done it. Sonoma either doesn't work at all or does without the GUI per an earlier post.

I was curious about my 828mkII connected via FW400–800 cable plugged into a FW–TB adapter plugged into a TB2 dock out to the TB2–TB3 adapter (whew!). Ok... Audio worked fine over Ventura; never checked MIDI.

So… Running Sonoma, I hooked it up, opened DP where it showed up as it should. Good
Moving onto MIDI, it didn't show up in Audio MIDI Setup.app. Dang! Then I remembered that I hadn't installed MOTU Audio Installer (UB 89555).pkg since Ventura. Oh hell, what can it hurt, right? So I did, rebooted and there it was.



The AIR, like the M2/M4/M6, is Core MIDI so that just shows up with no drivers.

While poking around, I see that the Installer now has a Read Me that M1/2/3 owners need to read about Apple Security Settings. This is info not contained in the other tech bulletin we all know (really, MOTU? This info should be on one page!). Although your Mac should prompt you through all of this, it's helpful to read first. Anyway, here's the link to the pages:

https://motu.com/techsupport/technotes/ ... udio-inst/

It annoys me to no end that they won't support the MTP/AV. There is no chance I will buy one of their XT express because of that. Anyway, hope you guys get it working. I'm on Monterey for the foreseeable future so I haven't had to worry about it.

dewdman42 wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:23 pm It annoys me to no end that they won't support the MTP/AV. There is no chance I will buy one of their XT express because of that. Anyway, hope you guys get it working. I'm on Monterey for the foreseeable future so I haven't had to worry about it.

I'll be running a little experiment on that soon but am waiting on something to arrive first.

On a clean install of Sonoma 14.2.1 the MTP AV does work. If it's not working when updating/upgrading to Sonoma, there's most likely some previous baggage getting in the way.